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M07S
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
http://plxdevices.com/PLXApp004.htm

I was reading the latest issue of Grassroots Motorsports when I came across an article on wideband O2 sensors. Reading into it, it said you CAN replace stock narrowband sensors with wideband sensors. It also stated that only 2 wideband sensors are made, the Bosch LSU 4.2 and the Japanese NTK designed for some Honda product. They also stated that the narrowband they tested along with 4 different wideband controllers (2 used the Bosch and 2 used the NTK sensor) gave the same readings while the narrowband was all over the place.

So I was wondering if replacing the stock O2 sensor(s) with wideband sensor(s) would be ideal, and if we should replace one or both?
 

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JoelAZ said:
http://plxdevices.com/PLXApp004.htm

I was reading the latest issue of Grassroots Motorsports when I came across an article on wideband O2 sensors. Reading into it, it said you CAN replace stock narrowband sensors with wideband sensors. It also stated that only 2 wideband sensors are made, the Bosch LSU 4.2 and the Japanese NTK designed for some Honda product. They also stated that the narrowband they tested along with 4 different wideband controllers (2 used the Bosch and 2 used the NTK sensor) gave the same readings while the narrowband was all over the place.

So I was wondering if replacing the stock O2 sensor(s) with wideband sensor(s) would be ideal, and if we should replace one or both?
You can do that, but that unit uses it's controller to send a narrowband signal back to the ECU. If you just tryed to connect a wideband to your stock ECU (I don't think you could because the conectors may be different) then your ECU probably wouldn't recognize the wideband signal.

Most good wideband units out there will have a narrowband output. The only real reason you would need to switch to a wideband would be if you want to roughly street tune your car.
 

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I think the best thing to do is to leave the 2 OEM narrowband O2 sensors there in their default locations and add a third wideband O2 sensor.

The best spot would be on the end of the collector/header where it can take a reading of the 4 cylinders exhausts but prior to any cat. On the Hotshot, have a bung welded on the last piping portion oriented in the front of the car and put the wideband in there. Then, hook it up to a gauge and/or a piggyback A/F controller that support it.

Darkstar have done this for his AEM UEGO and it work like a charm ;)http://www.aempower.com/product_ems.asp
 

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M07S
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
cburwell said:
The only real reason you would need to switch to a wideband would be if you want to roughly street tune your car.
A narrowband O2 sensor reads from 14.2-15.2 if they are tuned to read around stoichiometric a/f ratio (14.7), and they are heated to help provide consistent results, but may still vary based on exhaust gas temperature fluctuations. Wideband sensors read from 10-20 in the a/f ratio and are much more consistent. When I first dyno'd my Spec V, it was reading around 12 and that would simply tell the ECU that the mixture is rich, but the wideband would be good enough to tell the ECU how rich.

Also, rough tuning may be more important to some people.
 

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I talked to a tech at AEM about the Uego controller, and he stated that he would not replace the primary factory o2 sensor with a wideband unit because even though the uego converts the signal output voltages associated with a narrowband the ECU might still have a hard time dealing with the consistancy of the signal...

He recommended using it as a tuning device with a fuel controller (SAFC) only.
 

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M07S
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
angel2167882 said:
Darkstar have done this for his AEM UEGO and it work like a charm ;)
The stock ECU has some level of A/F control for the car, which is why I would want to switch, and the consistency provided by a wideband would help a lot, which is why Nissan switched them. The real question is if there would be benefits on an 02 model because of the ability for the ECU to properly read the a/f ratio?
 

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Yeah well Darkstar use the output from the UEGA gauge to tune his SAFC manually so it will compensate for the poor ECU A/F adjustement. I know I know, nothing is perfect but at least, it work fine ;)

And BTW, I think it's only 2004 Auto SE-R that got wideband...
 

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WTF is a B15?
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angel2167882 said:
I think the best thing to do is to leave the 2 OEM narrowband O2 sensors there in their default locations and add a third wideband O2 sensor.

The best spot would be on the end of the collector/header where it can take a reading of the 4 cylinders exhausts but prior to any cat. On the Hotshot, have a bung welded on the last piping portion oriented in the front of the car and put the wideband in there. Then, hook it up to a gauge and/or a piggyback A/F controller that support it.

Darkstar have done this for his AEM UEGO and it work like a charm ;)http://www.aempower.com/product_ems.asp
I've done this and works very well. I would suggest this route over replacing any of the o2 sensors.

As far as using the narrowband output to the ecu, I don't know what type of benefit that would realistically give you. During open loop (where you'll most likely be when you're racing -drag, street, or mountains), the ecu doesn't even rely on the o2 sensors. During closed loop, the ecu relies on the o2 sensor, MAF, knock sensor, etc. to determine fuel injector pulse, ignition timing, cam timing, etc, so the o2 sensors don't have that much of an impact on ecu adjustment.
 

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I read the article as well... very good reading. I had been doing research for a couple weeks on A/F ratios for the Spec and SAFC-II's... Sure enough, my dad hands me his GRM and there is an article on this stuff. Love it. Wideband is the way to go, but still alittle too pricey as of now. The technology will come down eventualy and it will become a common tuning tool. Unfortuanately you still have to use a piggyback or stand alone fuel management system to control the A/F ratios.
 
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